Native BIOS?

[solis]

I'm just wondering is this emulator is going have a native bios. It would be great to have another emulator with native bios other than pcsx that works for windows Xp or Linux.

[Truth Unknown]

That question is is very hard to answer since many Emulator Authors where subject to copyright (and anything related that Sony will make up) trials by Sony. Also pSX author (if i remember right) has not said anything about it.

[patrickp]

I think the Connectix VGS case established fairly well (in the US, anyway) that, not only is constructing a native BIOS legal, but that having Playstation BIOSs and examining them for the purpose of constructing a 'native' BIOS is also legal, as long as the native BIOS so produced is new code, and not just copied from the Playstation code.

However, it became clear from the Bleem! and Connectix cases that Sony are not in the least reluctant to pursue unwinnable suits simply in order to cause the defendants costs that they can't afford, and stop them producing workable Playstation emulators that way.

However, Bleem! and Connectix VGS were both commercial emulators; I don't think Sony have pursued any freeware emulator producers, although I can't help but feel that they would if they thought anything was to be gained from it. Obviously, one of the fundamental aspects of any suit they might bring would have to be the gain that an emulator producer makes from what they do, and also, every suit they bring that fails creates a precedent that prejudices the courts against them in future actions.

Having said that though, while the emulator is distributed and supported through American (I think) sites, pSX Author has said before that he lives (and presumably works) in the UK. This might make it possible for Sony to bring an action against him here, which would mean that the case would be tried in a court where first, the American precedents would have no standing, particularly the decision on Connectix' development of a native BIOS, and secondly, copyright law is more restrictive than in the US, particularly with regard to electronic copyright.

[Ultima]

pSX Author has said it's not likely to happen, though I guess he didn't really say "no" outright.

[patrickp]

I guess he's probably got enough to do as it is without spending time analysing how BIOSs work with games and consoles, and figuring out how to duplicate that.

After all, even the really dumb members here seem to manage to wind up with a BIOS somehow (sometimes after the magic word 'google' has been uttered...)!

[Sune]

I bet my mother in law could find a Playstation BIOS with google.

[patrickp]

I bet your mother-in-law already has... ;D

[kinghanco]

As long the playstation logo doesn't shown on the screen and copyrights aren't mark in BIOS when making a BIOS. Sony can't do anything about it. You can make your own BIOS from scratch. What Sony going to do about anyone making a BIOS from scratch? Nothing period.

Its a shame that Bleem didn't make their own BIOS from scratch.

That is the way I think about this.

[Ultima]

*Moved into Feedback & Suggestions forum, linkified in Known Requests thread as discussion grounds*

[patrickp]

What Sony going to do about anyone making a BIOS from scratch? Nothing period

Well, considering that a major part of the actions Sony brought against Connectix VGS was specifically around Connectix doing exactly that, I think the opposite is true. Sony lost, of course (poor Sony. How my heart bleeds for them... another totally true statement... ) which, hopefully, will make them more cautious in future, but there's no doubt they're not unwilling to bring actions like this.

The bottom line, of course, is that they don't necessarily care if they lose, as long as the action causes the defendant to suffer serious financial damage. They _did_ lose the actions they brought against Bleem! and Connectix, but bringing those suits nevertheless succeeded in putting Bleem! out of business, and caused Connectix such loss that they really had no option but to sell out to Sony.

[Haldrie]

The thing about those emulators though is that they were making a profit by selling them while emulators like pSX and ePSXe (and yes the many others out there now) are free to download making the creator(s) no profit what so ever so it's not like Sony could profit from sueing freeware emulators since the authors are usually living paycheck to paycheck or from the donation they get.

[patrickp]

Sony's motive in acting against Bleem! and Connectix certainly weren't for making money out of the suits. They lost all the actions they brought, so they can't have made any money out of it, and must have spent quite a bit, as well.

It's possible, though, that the commercial aspect was involved: Sony would probably have tried to use the fact that Bleem! and Connectix were making money from their emulators to demonstrate that they were causing Sony loss. Poor Sony.

But it's fairly clear that Sony's real motives were to kill the emulators, which they succeeded in doing. It would probably be more difficult to do this with a non-commercial emulator, as in that case a court would probably not be so lenient in allowing Sony to cause financial loss to the defendant, and also financial loss would not necessarily prevent the developer from continuing, as it would with an organisation that has to continue showing profits.

Having already lost cases against two companies would put Sony in a poor position if they wanted to do the same to someone else, as the new victim would be able to cite precedents from the previous cases, and more negative precedents would do Sony's postion more harm.

However, as I've mentioned previously, pSX Author is not in quite such a strong position. He's previously mentioned that he's resident in the UK, and if Sony were able to bring suit there rather than in the US, they would have the advantages that the US precedents would not have any validity in the UK courts and that UK copyright law, particularly as regards software, tends to be more restrictive than US law.

But they would still find it hard to bring a successful action, I think, and a loss in the UK courts would establish precedent over here. Furthermore, a UK decision, unlike a US decision, could have an influence on European law in general since, nominally at least, the laws of most European countries, including UK law, are increasingly being based on European law.

[Ultima]

Since different BIOS versions behave differently, wouldn't that mean pSX Author would have to create different versions of the built-in BIOS?

The request, as nice as it may be, sounds like a real pain to implement, and would really detract from the "accurate emulation" goal. If he ever did decide to do this, I think it'd be at the very end of his todo list, since problems with the native BIOS would crop up all over the place, and it'd be difficult to tell whether a problem was caused due to inaccurate emulation, or due to his in-house BIOS.

[patrickp]

It might be possible, I suppose, to write the 'native' BIOS so all regions can be played, much as the Net Yaroze was supposed to be able to. However, for optimum results, I suppose you'd still have to provide options for correcting the aspect ratio, as PAL and NTSC games differ slightly.

[kinghanco]

I don't think pSX Author willing to make BIOS. It would be pain in the butt trying to work on those from scratch. It would be nice to have more stabled BIOS made from scratch.

There will be an issue though. People willing to upload those BIOS onto their machine which is a bad idea. Maybe he could make a database with BIOS infos that is written from scratch so that nobody can upload those onto their playstation machine. Added some dip switches as well.

We ether use real BIOS or database BIOS.

At my mind this may not even happen at all.