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Post by castilho on Sept 2, 2006 8:49:27 GMT -5
GM in my opinion you're being too much influenced by the "classic" Chrono Trigger, like you want to see another Chrono Trigger around or something? Firstly Chrono Trigger is a good game I won't lie... 2nd Best RPG for the SNES as rated all over Japan, losing to FF6. But I think it lacks the "Soul" you said there is... The Plot is weak... sorry to tell you this Lavos' lovers, but it's a weak plot... well whtever I won't get in details. The point because it's so overrated is because it's an Easy, Straight-Foward game that barely needs thinking. A Begginer's RPG in my point of view. Man...you learn magic walking in a Room 3 times kissing the walls... why? The God of War wants to laugh at your misarable face wanting power Chrono Cross is a much more serious RPG, with some mid-dificulty parts and dungeons. There IS quite a lot of background, you probably just can't remember it or just skipped all the Char's Speech. Oh...and please...don't say that CC's soundtrack isn't fit to be a RPG one. It's great, I really think it went preety well with the Island Plot (Yeah, they're in an island, that's not the whole world). Well...That's all...for now Oh yes...the battle system... Chrono Trigger had an almost generic one, the only new thing was group attacks...quite fun to tell you the truth. Chrono Cross' one isn't complicated at all... It's like FF7's Materia system, and that's all...there's no other inovation in the system. Some combination attacks too that you barelly use. Now I'm finished ^^
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Post by Gamesoul Master on Sept 3, 2006 18:41:04 GMT -5
Something being simple doesn't make it bad. Saying that CT is a beginner's RPG is being quite cruel to the game. Pong is a simple, straight-forward game, but people (like me) still love playing it. It may not have been as "serious" as CC, but does it really need to be serious? Half it's fun was the fact that it wasn't a serious game. CT, however, did have a few points where there was a little difficulty. Half of a game's difficulty is in how you play it. I tend to play RPG's using no items whenever possible (curative/restorative items).
I know that CC had storyline, but what it offered wasn't quite so interesting once you got into the game. It tried, I know it tried... but it didn't really make the cut.
The soundtrack... this was something that has already been discussed and agreed on previously. In an RPG, the first function of the soundtrack is to set the mood of the storyline. And while CC has a very nice soundtrack (I have it and listen to it, even), it doesn't meet that requirement. It doesn't pull you in to the storyline... it does a better job of making you appreciate the environment of the game. While the environment is very nice and well-brought out by the soundtrack... this isn't a sweeping adventure game. Things like environment are a nice addition to RPG's, but they are near the bottom of the list of things that make an RPG truly great, and a soundtrack that emphasizes something so low on the list can be as great as it wants, but without serving it's primary function it doesn't fit.
I wasn't trying to say that CC had a "complex" battle system... it wasn't hard to learn at all. I was more pointing out that it had some more useless or unusual elements that were nice, but weren't put together nearly as well as they could've. That's more of a matter of bad luck than anything else... it just *happen* to not be as smooth as it could've. CT had a basic, generic battle system... true. But it worked very well for the game.
Whether a game is serious or childish... it is how the game is put together, how it flows... that makes a game. CC was serious, CT was childish... but CT had a better flow. Everything fit. Little more work could've been done on it (maybe a little more storyline), but CC had many things that could've been improved or changed to better the flow of the gameplay, the feel of the game. *That* is what I was trying to get at.
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Post by castilho on Sept 3, 2006 22:04:49 GMT -5
Well, seems no matter how much we discuss, "Taste" is always what makes a RPG good or bad for someone.
So, I'm stopping now. I disagree with you, and you with me. That's how most diferent taste discussions ends like. And as we know how it will end, might as well as not prolong it.
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Post by Gamesoul Master on Sept 3, 2006 23:20:15 GMT -5
True... we could go on like this forever, but it would only degenerate. They are different games after all, and so I agree that our tastes will of course be different. It was also one of the first RPG's I ever played, so I suppose I sometimes get a little too defensive about it (I hated the port to PS1... it was a major injustice to the game). Sorry I got a little carried away.
I'd like to toss in some votes, this time for the Lufia games (SNES) and for Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together (PSX). I like the Ogre Battle series, but I especially liked this one as it was more like a "Tactics" game. As for the Lufia games, the second game (the prequel, technically) was really fun to play, especially with the bonus dungeon that you can play through later in the game.
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Post by castilho on Sept 4, 2006 11:01:32 GMT -5
Man, it's really the Taste thing, I love Lufia 1 ^^ But Lufia 2 and it's puzzles got mw to think of it as a boring game.
And don't worry about getting carried away, I have some games I will defend forever: FF1, FF6 and FF8, Xenogears, Suikoden. There's always someone talking badly of them, so I get in the way.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2006 15:35:35 GMT -5
FF games are overrated. Vagrant Story is pretty awesome, and I expect FF12 to be super duper hyper extra turbo awesome, (first awesome ff game at that) because it's made by the same "team" as FFT and Vagrant Story. I mentioned Terranigma earlier, but I can't stress enough how great it is. Don't think it was released in US at all btw, so a lot of you might have missed it when it came out originally. It's right there in my favourite games of all time.
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Post by Ultima on Sept 6, 2006 15:49:08 GMT -5
From what I've heard, Final Fantasy XII is super duper awesome
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Post by castilho on Sept 6, 2006 15:59:45 GMT -5
@herra : That's why you think FFs are overrated, you like Vagrant Story and FFT But I agree with Terranigma being a good game.
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Post by Gamesoul Master on Sept 6, 2006 21:25:38 GMT -5
I find it easier to agree with anybody who actually thinks that Vagrant Story is a great game. Some people say it was rather slow and boring, but I really loved it for it's gameplay and customization options. It also had a great storyline. Final Fantasy Tactics... I can't enough good things about it. I had zero complaints about it. Terranigma... very good game.
How about the Shining Force games, y'all? Nearly every one that I played (not counting Shining Tears and Shining Force Neo... neither of which should be counted as Shining Force games) were simply awesome. Despite my love of town-wandering and power-leveling in games (usually the second time or later through the game), they were very fun to play. A few of them you *could* power-level in... but the Shining Force games usually make you *not* want to do that, as it's quite fun to just play the game straight and enjoy the challenges.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2006 18:03:04 GMT -5
Never played any Shining Force games. It's unfortunate but my backlog on games in general just keeps on growing on daily basis. It starts from NES era and ends in some of the more recent games, like say Shadow of the Colossus. Somewhere in there are Xenogears, Chrono Cross, Metroid series, tons of Sega games that I don't even want to start counting (I was a Nintendo kid on NES and SNES era), a pile of PC games (mostly point & click adventures, Monkey Islands, Indiana Jones' and the likes) and damn if I have the time to play anything anymore.
I miss the days when I could just sink into a game without a worry of anything else.
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Post by psicomaniaco on Sept 10, 2006 12:18:41 GMT -5
Anyway, I won't enter the CC - CT discusion, since its getting very old. Both games are good, you just can't compare the two, because they are too diferent games. I mentioned Terranigma earlier, but I can't stress enough how great it is. Don't think it was released in US at all btw, so a lot of you might have missed it when it came out originally. It's right there in my favourite games of all time. I agree. I played all three games of the series, but the third one is the best one. Weird is that it was THE ONLY ONE that wasn't released on USA. BTW, if you haven't already, pay attention to Terranigma's soundtrack, and you'll hear some of the best songs ever made for a RPG. In fact, most Enix games have great musics. Oh, for the ones that don't know: First came Soul Blazer, then Illusions of Gaia then Terranigma.
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Post by Gamesoul Master on Sept 10, 2006 13:28:39 GMT -5
Terranigma is definitely the best out of the three. While the first two were fun, they didn't keep my interest anywhere near as strongly as Terranigma did.
And indeed, Enix games *do* tend to have very good soundtracks. The amount of .spc and .psf archives I have for Enix games is pretty strong proof of that (as a note, I like playing all kinds of games, and so I have soundtracks from many different genres of games, not just RPG's).
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kiru
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Post by kiru on Sept 10, 2006 13:54:18 GMT -5
Strange, just by reading this, i hear the terranigma soundtrack... ^^ just a coincidence? :> I have to agree with the soundtracks... Well, it´s really sad that it´s square-enix now Enix was together with atlus and working design my favorite publisher Well, atlus still remains and brings us great games developed by banpresto (super robot taisen: og and summon night) Even if you don´t have a gba and you are a rpg-fan, buy one with riviera, super robot taisen:og and summon night. The last two will get a sequel later this year (and a new one called yggdra union get a release in the usa as well) These six games alone will make it very worthwhile. (+ a lot of other great games^^)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2006 5:15:33 GMT -5
Yeah, Terranigma soundtrack is pretty awesome indeed. Masanori Hikichi and Miyoko Kobayashi rock.
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Post by thedigitalnomad on Nov 11, 2006 0:50:03 GMT -5
Fallout and Fallout 2 (PC), and Star Ocean: The Second Story (PSX) are my top picks for RPGs (not that I really consider SO2 to be an actual RPG, but whatever).
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